BE ADVISED: Proposed Ordinance Banning Shark Fishing

[Sean Paxton]

Hello Everyone,

Zach Miller brought this important matter to my attention last evening. Everyone reading this should take immediate interest in proposed City of Delray Beach ordinance number: 37-09. The following is the ordinance language as I received it today from the city. Along with Zach, and my brother, Brooks, I will be taking a lead role in representing ourselves and all those who value their rights as recreational anglers, law-abiding, tax and license paying citizens of the great state of Florida and these United States.

Through arrangement with Tommy, this topic will be temporarily locked until we gain more information and form a system of organizing our position. I can not stress enough the importance of everyone to remain informed of the facts. With regard to our response, there is not doubt the eyes and ears of those on both sides, including key and influential decision-makers, will be monitoring our every word and action. With that said, I implore everyone to proceed in an informed, reasonable, respectable and responsible manner, with regard to this precedent-setting issue.

Here's the pertinent information as we know it now with more to follow:

Commission Reading: Tuesday July 7th, 2009
Public Meeting: Tuesday July 21st, 2009

A decision to approve or deny the ordinance may be made at the July 21st meeting. There is also the possibility of extending that approval or denial, depending on various factors, including additional input or information provided from the public or others that could result in more time being needed to render a decision.

City Commission Website Link. The 'Agenda and Minutes' (upper left) will be updated with information relevant to this topic by 7pm, this evening:
http://www.mydelraybeach.com/Delray/Cit ... efault.htm


ORDINANCE NO. 37-09

AN ORDINANCE OF THE CITY COMMISSION OF THE CITY OF
DELRAY BEACH, FLORIDA, AMENDING CHAPTER 101, “PARKS,
BEACHES, AND RECREATION”, BY ENACTING A NEW SECTION
101.37, “SHARK FISHING”, TO PROHIBIT SHARK FISHING
WITHIN THREE HUNDRED FEET OF THE MUNICIPAL BEACH;
PROVIDING A GENERAL REPEALER CLAUSE, A SAVING CLAUSE
AND AN EFFECTIVE DATE.

WHEREAS, the City Commission of the City of Delray Beach Florida, has the authority to protect the
public health, safety, and welfare of its citizens; and
WHEREAS, the City Commission of the City of Delray Beach, Florida, has determined it to be in the
public’s best interest to establish reasonable regulations regarding fishing on the municipal beach.
NOW THEREFORE, BE IT ORDAINED BY THE CITY COMMISSION OF THE CITY OF
DELRAY BEACH, FLORIDA AS FOLLOWS:
Section 1. That a new Section 101.37, “Shark Fishing”, amending Chapter 101, “Parks, Beaches
and Recreation”, of the Code of Ordinances of the City of Delray Beach, Florida, shall be enacted to read as
follows:
Sec. 101.37. SHARK FISHING.

(A) No shark fishing shall be allowed within three hundred feet (300’) of the municipal
beach;

(B) No baiting or chumming shall be allowed on or within three hundred feet (300’) of the
municipal beach. Baiting or chumming is defined as using cut up or ground up bait to put an attracting
scent line on or below the surface of the water, or to visually attract other fish;

(C) The use of shark lures and rigs shall be strictly prohibited within three hundred feet
(300’) of the municipal beach; and

(D) All accidental shark catches must be cut loose. No landing or reeling in of sharks shall
be allowed on the municipal beach.

Section 2. That should any section or provision of this ordinance or any portion thereof, any
paragraph, sentence, clause or word be declared by a court of competent jurisdiction to be invalid, such
decision shall not affect the validity of the remainder hereof as a whole or part hereof other than the part
declared invalid.
2 ORD NO. 37-09
Section 3. That all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict herewith be, and the same are
hereby repealed.
Section 4. That this ordinance shall become effective upon its passage on second and final reading.
PASSED AND ADOPTED in regular session on second and final reading on this the _____ day of
___________________, 2009.

ATTEST:

____________________________ _____________________________
City Clerk M A Y O R

First Reading __________________

Second Reading ________________

[Team rebel]

To ALL forum memebers, Shark Fisherman, and Recreational Anglers.


The proposition of Ordinance 37-09 was read at the City of Delray's agenda meeting last Tuesday to make this official. This is in fact a very serious issue that may not only affect residents and fisherman in the city of Delray beach or those whom patron the beaches here to fish, but could be precident setting for other beaches on the east and west coast of Florida to do the same. This is a serious issue and shorebound anglers rights must be protected and upheld. If there is any questions at this time myself or Sean Paxton will be more than happy to educate everybody on the details of this upon request. We encourage not just shark fisherman, not just patrons of Delray Beach, but all of the shorebound fishing community to chime in on this with thier questions and non-bashing opinions of this act/ ordinance being presented to us in the next coming weeks in this critical situation.


-Zach Miller

[crashmister]

Does anybody know what prompted this?

[BoatlessFisherman]

Hello all

Some may think Oh its just another city taking Shark fishing away, I see this happenning now a lot, no worries for me I don't Shark Fish "SO I don't have time to be involved".

But let me tell you that this is a very unclear ordinances for Delray and I believe it could be used to also stop fishing in general in that city on the beach or the start to get it there.

The Bottom line is:

We as in Landbased, Shorebound or Boatless do need to start to organize and stop this from happening in County's and City's in this State "FLORIDA". Commercial and Boat fisherman have many organized groups to help in fighting for there "Right to Fish" also the guidelines in the way they fish and so we should also.

This thread is to help us to organize a responsible, intelligent, Argument to take to the City of Delray and we need everyones help in putting this together. This thread is for those who will be actively supporting this, will then have opinions of others to help in supplying questions and answers in stopping this or changing it to make what laws are changed do what they need to stop the people "as in all who bring this stuff down on the good" .

Yes we do need some laws to better protect our beaches,.
As in maybe no harvesting of Sharks from public beaches, severer actions for those who litter, also the consumption of Alcohol, etc.


This is not a bash contest so please leave that out of here, also do not side track this thread.

This is about your right as a Florida resident, Tax payer to be able to enjoy happiness and Fish.

I want to start this by sharing with you two things.

1. The Florida Constitution
SECTION 2. Basic rights.--All natural persons, female and male alike, are equal before the law and have inalienable rights, among which are the right to enjoy and defend life and liberty, to pursue happiness, to be rewarded for industry, and to acquire, possess and protect property; except that the ownership, inheritance, disposition and possession of real property by aliens ineligible for citizenship may be regulated or prohibited by law. No person shall be deprived of any right because of race, religion, national origin, or physical disability.

History.--Am. S.J.R. 917, 1974; adopted 1974; Am. proposed by Constitution Revision Commission, Revision No. 9, 1998, filed with the Secretary of State May 5, 1998; adopted 1998.


2. Your Right to Fish as giving by this Great State of Florida
The 2008 Florida Statutes

Title XXVIII
NATURAL RESOURCES; CONSERVATION, RECLAMATION, AND USE

Chapter 379
FISH AND WILDLIFE CONSERVATION


379.104 Right to hunt and fish.--The Legislature recognizes that hunting, fishing, and the taking of game are a valued part of the cultural heritage of Florida and should be forever preserved for Floridians. The Legislature further recognizes that these activities play an important part in the state's economy and in the conservation, preservation, and management of the state's natural areas and resources. Therefore, the Legislature intends that the citizens of Florida have a right to hunt, fish, and take game, subject to the regulations and restrictions prescribed by general law and by s. 9, Art. IV of the State Constitution.

History.--s. 8, ch. 2002-46; s. 8, ch. 2008-247.

Note.--Former s. 372.002.

[Sean Paxton]

We have our sources, and are in the process of confirming them, along with other critical details, as part and parcel of our response to the proposed ordinance. Although important, how this started is not as much of a priority as the ultimate outcome.

stp

[fixed80]

most likely how this thang came up is that someone or some people complained
about this type of fishing from shore. it usually is most of the time.
i hear this quite often from other SF anglers, saying how somebody tried
to get rid of em by calling the police.
most certainly this is not a one city problem. sooner or later
SF will be banned from any well known public beach and access cross there is.
so it all boils down to this point, beach bathers have their beach and anglers have another.

[BigBoiFishing]

In this struggling economy all windows for financial gain are being monitored and considered. For instance, Florida's economy really thrives on tourism. The last thing Florida needs is less tourism, on top of that, whatever tourists that are able to make it down here are seeing sharks being pulled up to shore, that really wouldn't make a tourist from Wyoming a return "customer". Especially when all they saw in their vacation pamphlets were beautiful beaches and Margaritas.

All in all, its our right to enjoy the fruits of our beautiful state that we pay taxes and live in. Its our right. Fishing is what separates Florida from the rest.

It gives the youth an oppotunity to partake in a recreation that teaches them, skill, discipline, ambition, creativity & respect for ones natural surroundings.

Eventually these children grow up to become, disciplined, ambitious, creative & conservationalists. If you ask me, thats a pretty good beginning & future.

Politics are webs, they start from the center and eventually cover a large area afterwards. Its true what BF says, this will effect everyone in the end. Even if it does not, imagine if you were living in Delray and heard of such thing, you'd want others with common passions to speak out in favor of your right to fish.

In closing, less shorebound fisherman (which is the absolute most accessable way to fish) only leads to more boaters, yes the economy will benefit but more boaters equals more pollution. Less shorebound fisherman, leaves more time in the hands of the youth to become lazy and most likely not respect their natural surroundings due to the lack of involvement in it. Eventhough it is our responsibilty to guide our children as their parents, hands on involvement influences a lot more than words in the busy minds of the young.


Besides I really never listened to my parents as a kid.

[permitchaser]

gio is not going to be a happy when i tell him sorry for the shark boyz .i hope it wont happen

[BigBoiFishing]

gio is not going to be a happy when i tell him sorry for the shark boyz .i hope it wont happen

That right there is a prime example as to my point. I bet you anything Raul, you would prefer you son to be a fisherman over roaming the streets of Florida god knows doing what, anyday of the week.

I'm getting my 5yr old into fishing little by little, hes almost at the point that he can correctly identify fish. I'd rather him fish (which is a healthy hobby) than sit at home playing video games and going to nightclubs when he is older.


I know a lot of us here struggle to stay in Florida because of our love for fishing. To take that right away from those who can't afford a vessel is down right cruel.

[Sean Paxton]

Good points, BigBoi.

Adding a new dynamic to this issue is the fact that Gov. Charlie Crist signed a $66.5 billion state budget into law recently, and it includes a measure to create Florida’s FIRST license requirement for resident saltwater anglers who fish only from docks, piers or the shore. The law technically takes effect in July, with enforcement expected to begin in earnest Aug. 1. The shoreline license is priced at $7.50, plus $1.50 in processing fees, for a total $9 cost. People who already hold Florida’s $17 annual saltwater license to fish from a boat are not required to buy an additional license to fish from shore.

For card-carrying, shore-bound anglers, will also come some added legal rights including that of representation.

stp

[permitchaser]

gio is not going to be a happy when i tell him sorry for the shark boyz .i hope it wont happen

That right there is a prime example as to my point. I bet you anything Raul, you would prefer you son to be a fisherman over roaming the streets of Florida god knows doing what, anyday of the week.

I'm getting my 5yr old into fishing little by little, hes almost at the point that he can correctly identify fish. I'd rather him fish (which is a healthy hobby) than sit at home playing video games and going to nightclubs when he is older.


I know a lot of us here struggle to stay in Florida because of our love for fishing. To take that right away from those who can't afford a vessel is down right cruel.

you right the problem with gio is he only wants to shark fishing

[BigBoiFishing]

Good points, BigBoi.

Adding a new dynamic to this issue is the fact that Gov. Charlie Crist signed a $66.5 billion state budget into law recently, and it includes a measure to create Florida’s FIRST license requirement for resident saltwater anglers who fish only from docks, piers or the shore. The law technically takes effect in July, with enforcement expected to begin in earnest Aug. 1. The shoreline license is priced at $7.50, plus $1.50 in processing fees, for a total $9 cost. People who already hold Florida’s $17 annual saltwater license to fish from a boat are not required to buy an additional license to fish from shore.

For card-carrying, shore-bound anglers, will also come some added legal rights including that of representation.

stp

To implement a law that entails that and to exclude others (due to their area of residence) from what that law requires them to be, which is to be a legal shorebound fisherman, is not righteous. Its almost discrimination, considering the fact they cannot fish shorebound because they live in a certain area. While others enjoy the right to fish shorebound only miles away, is not the American way.

I hate to be cliche', but we are all created equal and should all be able to enjoy the same rights and follow the same laws. Especially when the proximity to each scenario is so close.

[crashmister]

Fixed & Big; The problem is we don't have much time as this will be reread on the 21st of this month and could be voted on at that time. Knowing the exact circumstances is imperative to present arguments against it.

[BigBoiFishing]

Fixed & Big; The problem is we don't have much time as this will be reread on the 21st of this month and could be voted on at that time. Knowing the exact circumstances is imperative to present arguments against it.

Regardless, those are my thoughts on the matter. Hopefully all will go in favor of the Sharkers in Delray.

[crashmister]

I believe we need to question the legality and legitimacy of this ordinance. As Tommy posted I firmly believe that this ord. is in conflict with the state constitution. To be clear I dont want to say it violates it but is in conflict with it. PLEASE post your questions and comments here. It would be helpful to hear what everyone and I mean EVERYONE thinks or more importantly what anyone does not understand about this. Again PLEASE keep it eloquent concise and respectfull. Once you read the ord. I am sure everyone will have questions. What I want everyone to understand is these questions are far more important right now than opinions. While I am intrested in everyones opinion and do not want to diminish the value of them the right question or questions could be enough to shelve or even help promote a coperative dialog with the DelRay beach city council. For the time being lets keep it here dont write any letters until we get more specifics about who what and where.

[Sean Paxton]

Nice talking with you earlier ...

He's spot on about placing an emphasis on asking questions. The more we have, the more they're required to answer. The more they're unable to answer ... well, we'll see. In the meantime, let's get this party started. Just start tossing 'em up here. We'll compile them all, along with the answers, if they exist or as they're determined or come available. Then, we should work together on the execution of a coordinated presentation.

I've got plenty, but might as well start chipping away, right off the top of the main body of the ordinance with Item (A):
Q: What are the specific geographic boundaries of the 'municipal beach'?
A: To be determined ...

Q: Is 300' referring to the north and south boundaries or offshore?
A: To be determined ... in the meantime, I'd be curious to hear what our boat-hunting counterparts would make of this one.

Stay Tuned:
stp

[crashmister]

Same here Sean. Here are a few of mine 300 feet from what part of the beach H/L tide? As we discussed what specifically is a shark rig? Define shark Bait. Is the city of DelRay going to educate their Police department about shore fishing in an effort to eliminate any false arrests? They are taking on the duties of the FWC. Are they qualified to do so? Does this create a conflict or overlap? Example: If the DRPD and the FWC show up at the same time who would have jurisdiction? Is this ord. meant to include spear fishing from the beach? What is a shark lure. Why is cut bait included in such a general manner. Why is chum included? Neither are exclusive to shark fishing.

[Sean Paxton]

Looks like we've got ourselves a list going.

Just received a few answers to the questions I posed earlier:

From Item (A):

Q: What are the specific geographic boundaries of the 'municipal beach'?
A: The municipal beach boundaries are legally described in the Code of Ordinances under Section 101.15. The Boundary to the north is simply the area north of Atlantic Avenue where the boats and beach end and residences begin. The Boundary to the south is Casuarina Rd. just north of the Seagate Club, excluding Atlantic Dunes Park, which is also part of the municipal beach.

Q: Is 300' referring to the north and south boundaries or offshore?
A: North & South

Poses a new question:

Q: What jurisdiction does the city of Delray Beach have over those 300' to the north and south of and adjoining the 'municipal beach' boundaries?
A: To be determined ...

[fixed80]

As we discussed what specifically is a shark rig? Define shark Bait. Is the city of DelRay going to educate their Police department about shore fishing in an effort to eliminate any false arrests?

#1 what specifically is a shark rig? any type of metal leader with a certain size hook(what-ever it can be) or bigger would probably define as a shark rig.

#2 Define shark Bait. any species of fish that feeds on other fish, and crustaceans is definitely defined as shark bait no matter what size it is.
pretty much like this. if a fish feeds on plankton, algae, weeds and ex is non shark bait.

#3 police really shouldn't be involved with situations like that. yet sometimes FWC cant always be there to enforce the law in most cases.

And about this 300 foot rule, delray would rather it be in yds and not feet. making it much further between fishermen and swimmers.

[crashmister]

Fixed; Actually we are looking for DelRays definition of the questions above. If this were to pass it would be a DelRay ordinance. FWC would not enforce it as they have no such rule and they don't work for DelRay. The whole idea here is to Read the proposed ordinance and ask questions as to the vagueness of it. The questions we are putting forth here are a way of compiling questions to put to the city. They are required by law to answer them as long as they are valid and presented in an intelegent and respectful manner. The more they can't answer the less chance this passes. While your answers are technically correct the ordinance leaves far to much to interpretation.

[fixed80]

Fixed; Actually we are looking for DelRays definition of the questions above.

i kno. just wanted to answer it in my def.

[BigBoiFishing]

This becomes very interesting at this point, taking into consideration there are many forms of fishing.

Fishing at this moment becomes our ultimate tool, not in defiance but in specifics and lack of a solid law.

I've caught many hammers while trying to fish for grouper for example...thats a by-catch. I truly believe those who feel necessary to pass this ordinance should consider fishing themselves. As they are treading on areas they do not meander frequently on.

Hence, fishing in itself has a very unpredictable outcome.

For example(s).

A fisherman fishing for Goliath Grouper which is illegal to harvest; but still llegal to target for recreational purposes, just so happens to utilize the same equipment and bait as a Sharker , would that fall under this ordinance?

The reason this inquiry is mentioned is simply because there is no way to determine if a shorebound fisherman is truly shark fishing or fishing for another species.

In example, a great example as I may add.

They (the photo below) were fishing in a shark tournament, using fishing gear, bait and beach. And this beautiful creature became a by-catch, a majestic one if I may add.



1. How can a local Law Enforcement Officer determine what is shark fishing? Being that he/her is trained in all aspects of the law but not in the area that defines an FWC Officer's agenda.

2. How at that moment can he/her determine what is being targeted, when there is such a thing as a by-catch?

3. If at that moment a local Law Enforcement Officer deems the scenario illegal; based upon visual guess-tamations (due to lack of training), then which item/action manifests the moment to be illegal?

4. The size of reel? --- Which is manufactured for the use of targeting a variety of species of fish.

5. The pound tested rated monofilament line, wire or braid that is used? --- Which is manufactured for the use of targeting a variety of species of fish.

6. Or would it be the bait? --- Which is used in many different manners and ways to target a variety of species of fish.

7. Would it be the "chum"? --- Which is used to attract gamefish and bait as well.

There are too many variances that prevent this ordinace from becoming a solidification of a law, that would only motivate it to be; a restriction based upon unprofessional, unpredictable assumptions. That will result in lawsuits and wasted tax dollars.

[Sean Paxton]

Nice work ... there's one of the 'ah-hah' moments I've been waiting for. This is and should be less about 'shark fishing' and abundantly more about the very questions you're posing regarding ... 'fishing', pure and simple. When you mix bait and saltwater, you (and no one, for that matter) could ever know what might pick up the other end of that line. Oddly enough, sometimes, that ends up being nothing. For anyone that prefers bigger, legally targeted, and in some cases harvested, recreational game, including many of the species you just mentioned, larger, commercially, marketed, sold and purchased gear is required.

Once again, nice work and completely relevant insight.
stp

[crashmister]

Big & Sean; Exactly right! This is more about an all out fishing ban than it ever was about Sharking. Our problem is if this is allowd to stand it will become a tool for developers to deny us the right to fish from any beach they want. Don't think for a minute the anti Sharking community is not watching this also. This kind of thing is exactly what they are looking for as a means by example to go to every beach front community and try to get this ban made law. The way the begining of the ord. reads (To promote the safty and security of the citizens of DelRay) obviously they think some how beach Sharking promotes an unsafe condition. We called this the Jaws syndrome in the 70s. Shark charters went through the roof and a bunch of dive shops went out of buesness. Since 1882 The state of Florida has had 610 shark attacks with 13 people killed. More people drown every year than have been killed by sharks in the last 110. I believe it's time to question the logic of even proposing this thing. BigBoy your post is the core argument against this ban. Great job dude!!!

[crashmister]

After doing some research I have found that not one of the attacks was in any way shape or form blamed on, attributed to, or associated with any form of hook and line beach fishing. In fact the only type of fishing even mentioned was spear fishing. Even then the risk is entirley on the diver doing the fishing. The overwhelming majority of those injuries were due to sharks trying to get speared fish NOT the diver. My point of the above post and this one is simply to refute any notion that beach fishing of any kind poses or creates any risk to swimmers or bathers. It simply has no bases in actual fact.

[Sean Paxton]

Zach Miller just brought the first nods to this issue in the press to my attention. There will be more.

The first story focuses more on the sport, while the second one is more ordinance-related.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sfl-shark-f ... 6134.story
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sfl-shark-f ... 6265.story

[Team rebel]

Maria wrote a very good article forshadowing what is about to occur, much more in the background that will be made clear tommorow, whole package from sun-sentinal will be released tommorow. And we will keep everybody posted


-Zach

[Goat]

Juno Pier was recently shut down to shark fishing after altercation between surfers and person with shark that was video taped and posted on You Tube. I have mentioned previously that the counties have been looking at this again. Beach goers, condo people, etc, smile and say oh cool when sharks are pulled up on the beach but they are running to the commissioners and police behind your backs to complain.

Per my previous posts they closed down all shark fishing along Jupiter/Juno beach in early 80's (it was instructions to the officers and not a formal amendment) and it took about 5 of us to meet with police, mayor, etc and we agreed to only fish at night so the amendment was held. There were hardly any people on the beach back then and very few beach side condos. They let us fish at night and there were only 8 people I know of who did it randomly and usually not all together (Bobby Wummer, Jeff from Stuart, William who had the record permit on Lake Worth Pier, Peanut, me and a few of my friends who would join me) but then the turtle people got involved on the beach at night so we started only fishing the Jupiter Inlet jetty (It was a very short jetty at that time) to let things cool off.

Now before the slammers come out of the woodwork at me again, I am just reporting what happened as a history lesson and I do not support shutting it down. There are a lot more people at the beaches and a lot more people now shark fishing. Once the public complains enough, the commissioners will play the safety card, insurance reasons, and turtle card. I have not seen anyone win against it yet. We were lucky in the early 80's that it got quiet. Heck back then in Jupiter it was legal to drink and drive so you can see it was a different mind set than it is today especially with all the people and all the lawyers.

[Goat]

One thing to add to my post above is there are a lot more people shark fishing but also there is more advertising of it. You will see the one big tourney got attention but this one is getting it also. It started out as basically an underground type tourney raising money for a special charity but has grown to a full blown advertised event with videos, etc. I know my words don't sit well with many people but I would recommended going more low key as you can see what the current public is pushing for and we could all loose the ability to shark fish on the beaches in our areas. THey do not care that it is catch and release. The push to start shutting it down started a couple years ago and I posted about that when I heard of it and I got blasted by several on this forum. Please do not shoot this messenger. I support shark fishing but I also have seen it get shut down and I hope you are successful in keeping Delray open. Jupiter Pier and the area in Ft Lauderdale were not successful.